Joined: 13 Aug 2006
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Posted: Sat Jan 06, 2007 10:55 am Post subject: randy comps 06
Player comparisons
Player comparisons
Player comparisons
Look the book on Rj is to elevate, and hope he has a bad back, he's still pretty darn tough to make contact against.
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Joined: 11 Aug 2006
Posts: 173
Location: Middlesbrough, UK
Posted: Sat Jan 06, 2007 11:38 am Post subject:
tmar wrote:
I guess we'll know by June what kind of deal we got. Til then I put my faith in JB, knowing he knows more than me.
Yep, its nice to be able to put trust in your teams GM. If your a Pirates fan you can't do that since most fans know more than him lol
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My dad used to say "Always fight fire with fire".... Which is probably why he was thrown out of the fire brigade
If you look at his numbers, there doesn't appear to be any way he should have been so bad last year. Other than the walk rate, nothing else jumps out as being a problem to me, and even that is not terrible. Although those numbers don't suggest the Randy we used to know and love, they suggest an effective pitcher.
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If you look at his numbers, there doesn't appear to be any way he should have been so bad last year. Other than the walk rate, nothing else jumps out as being a problem to me, and even that is not terrible.
Except for a) bad luck; and b) health.
Luck evens out and we're hoping his back with be better.
There is a reason I made that bet with shoewiz, you know.
Joined: 10 Aug 2006
Posts: 2404
Location: Gold Canyon
Posted: Wed Jan 10, 2007 10:19 pm Post subject:
Nice feel-good article on Randy
However, there's one point that I simply must address:
Matt Scarborough of Phoenix, 46, points out that no pitcher has ever won more than 13 games at age 43, with the exception of pitchers who throw knuckleballs and, illegally, spitballs.
Matt, please realize that wins are a team stat. If a pitcher does his job effectively but does not have defensive and offensive support, he cannot force his team to win.
As noted previously in another thread, following are three pitchers whose performances at age 43 were all-star worthy, team performance aside:
Roger Clemens -- 211.3 IP, 185 K's, 1.87 ERA, 1.008 WHIP, 221 ERA+
Nolan Ryan -- 204 IP, 232 K's, 3.44 ERA, 1.034 WHIP, 114 ERA+
Phil Niekro -- 234.3 IP, 144 K's, 3.61 ERA, 1.272 WHIP, 104 ERA+
If Randy matches any of the above, he will certainly have more than 13 wins this year with the Diamondbacks.
When I was in New York over the Christmas holidays, I went out for a night with Derek Jacques and his brother, Jeff. I've known them for 20 years, and they're the two biggest Yankee fans I know, so the conversation naturally turned to the Bombers and the potential Randy Johnson deal. I was pretty enthusiastic about it, as long as trading Johnson gave the Yankees access to the Diamondbacks' deep reserve of talent. Even if the top-tier guys, players like Chris Young and Carlos Quentin and Conor Jackson, would be unavailable, that still left a bevy of A-/B+ prospects to choose from.
The primary focus of our pool-hall debate was whether to do a deal that saved money or brought in talent. I came down firmly on the side of the latter; it would mean more to the Yankees in the long run to pick up a lot of Johnson's remaining salary if doing so allowed a greater return in the trade. If leveraging the organization's revenue advantage in the market had shown mixed results, doing so to replenish the farm system seemed like an approach with merit.
In the end, the Yankees and Brian Cashman went the other way, dealing away much of their financial obligation to Johnson—they’ll pay just $2 million to the D'backs—but not getting a very attractive package in return. Of the four players acquired in the deal, exactly zero were in Kevin Goldstein's list of the D'backs' top ten prospects. In a deep system like that of the Diamondbacks, even that might not be damning, but a look at the players headed east shows that the Yankees simply didn't get much back for the tall lefty.
Luis Vizcaino is a serviceable reliever, a good #3 man in a contender’s bullpen. There's not that much difference between him and Kyle Farnsworth, and he’s been more consistent over the past few years. The two pitching prospects in the deal are largely of a kind, college righthanders who are longer on command and skills than raw stuff, and who project as back-end guys in the majors. Both Russ Ohlendorf and Steven Jackson were '04 draftees, and both put up strong strikeout-to-walk ratios and low home-run rates at Double-A Tennessee last year, but mediocre strikeout rates for that level. That's not a combination that bodes well for 2007 at Triple-A or any kind of MLB future. The infielder, Alberto Gonzalez, is a poor man's Erick Aybar, a contact-hitting shortstop without much power. Suffice to say that Derek Jeter's job—hell, Miguel Cairo's job—is safe.
It's not easy to make a deal with the Diamondbacks and not come out of it with some upside, but that's what the Yankees have done. They've added to their stash of college-draftee pitchers—remember, they took Ian Kennedy and Joba Chamberlain in last year's draft—who don't project as stars, and added a utility-infield prospect and some relief help.
This wasn’t even the best package of guys you’ve never heard of; the Yankees, staring at a hole at first base, would have been better off working Scott Hairston, Chris Carter or Brian Barden into this deal than taking Vizcaino or Gonzalez. The Diamondbacks have no room for any of them, they can all hit and all are better short-term fixes than Rule 5 pick Josh Phelps.
This deal is a good win for the Diamondbacks, who are closer to contention in the NL West than most people realize. By adding a good starting pitcher—remember, PECOTA projects Johnson to have a 3.52 ERA this season—in exchange for four guys they'll never miss and some cash, they've improved the 2007 team for, essentially, nothing. They didn't trade any of their top ten prospects, not even guys down the list like Micah Owings or Dustin Nippert. This deal closes the gap between them and the Padres and Dodgers, and pretty much ensures at least a three-team race in the West.
Joined: 10 Aug 2006
Posts: 1871
Location: Phoenix, AZ
Posted: Thu Jan 11, 2007 9:54 am Post subject:
levski wrote:
joe sheehan gives his thoughts on the rj trade...
Quote:
It's not easy to make a deal with the Diamondbacks and not come out of it with some upside, but that's what the Yankees have done.
The legacy of a general manager who shall remain nameless. Guess they haven't figured out there's a new sheriff in town! Way to go, JB!
Quote:
This wasn’t even the best package of guys you’ve never heard of; the Yankees, staring at a hole at first base, would have been better off working Scott Hairston, Chris Carter or Brian Barden into this deal than taking Vizcaino or Gonzalez. The Diamondbacks have no room for any of them, they can all hit and all are better short-term fixes than Rule 5 pick Josh Phelps.
Now, is anybody in the FO paying attention to this assessment of Barden, Carter, and, especially, Hairston? Free Scott Hairston!
Quote:
This deal is a good win for the Diamondbacks, who are closer to contention in the NL West than most people realize. By adding a good starting pitcher—remember, PECOTA projects Johnson to have a 3.52 ERA this season—in exchange for four guys they'll never miss and some cash, they've improved the 2007 team for, essentially, nothing. They didn't trade any of their top ten prospects, not even guys down the list like Micah Owings or Dustin Nippert. This deal closes the gap between them and the Padres and Dodgers, and pretty much ensures at least a three-team race in the West.
Joined: 10 Aug 2006
Posts: 2404
Location: Gold Canyon
Posted: Thu Jan 11, 2007 10:17 am Post subject:
levski wrote:
EvilJuan wrote:
levski wrote:
joe sheehan gives his thoughts on the rj trade...
Quote:
It's not easy to make a deal with the Diamondbacks and not come out of it with some upside, but that's what the Yankees have done.
The legacy of a general manager who shall remain nameless. Guess they haven't figured out there's a new sheriff in town! Way to go, JB!
uh, that's not what sheehan meant.
Joe's point appears to be AZ's huge stockpile of real talent (how can you not get something of value out of all that?) rather than on who's watching the store.
Joined: 10 Aug 2006
Posts: 1871
Location: Phoenix, AZ
Posted: Thu Jan 11, 2007 10:25 am Post subject:
OK, let's rephrase Sheehan's comment of, "It's not easy to make a deal with the Diamondbacks and not come out of it with some upside, but that's what the Yankees have done."
"The Yankees have managed to do a deal with the Diamondbacks, a team that has a farm system loaded with prospects with lots of potential, and have failed to get the best value for RJ and the money they offered."
Or, more succinctly:
"The Yankees should have gotten more than they did."
Is that a fair assessment of what Sheehan meant, Lev?
MY observation is that the previous GM had a pattern in making trades that led others to the expectation that it was easy/easier to extract more value from a trade with the Diamondbacks than has happened in this trade. I give the credit for that to Josh Byrnes.
That's all I was trying to say...
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