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 Post subject: Re: The Chase experience and attendance
 Post Posted: Thu Mar 17, 2016 12:47 am 
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Might not be the best place for this but I couldn't find a thread about the announcers besides Sutton.

Ranking 14 announcers for Arizona sports

The relevant parts:

Quote:
2. Diamondbacks TV analyst Bob Brenly: The former major league catcher has a strong resume, and his local expertise is unassailable. Brenly managed the Diamondbacks to their World Series title, cementing his legacy. But it’s his ability to communicate baseball’s nuances in a credible, conversational way that makes him baseball’s best in show. There is the requisite self-deprecation (he wasn’t a great hitter), the humor and easygoing manner, but mostly, it’s his effortless analysis supported by a mountain of real-life experience that highlights Diamondbacks broadcasts.

8. Diamondbacks radio analyst Tom Candiotti: Strong, dependable, like his knuckleball during his playing days. Doesn’t venture outside the prototype analyst’s box too often, and that makes for a sometimes-too-straightforward presentation – but then, many radio listeners prefer that low-key chemistry provided by Candiotti and his play-by-play partner, Greg Schulte.

10. Diamondbacks TV play-by-play man Steve Berthiaume: An improvement, certainly, over Daron Sutton (too many words per broadcast) and perhaps Thom Brennaman (too much ego) but I’m sure even the Diamondbacks would acknowledge this was going to be a learn-on-the-job situation. Brenly helps the sometimes-overeager company guy dial it down at times, but viewers should continue to keep the volume-control button handy.

11. Diamondbacks radio play-by-play man Greg Schulte: An absolute pro. He has a golden voice that sometimes sounds over-golden, too perfect -- like the commercial hawker characters created by Dan Aykroyd and Phil Hartman on long-ago installments of "Saturday Night Live." The substance has a hard time catching up with the voice. Many times that comes off as unintentional - something akin to James Earl Jones extolling the virtues of a cat video. Putting it another way: It’s not really his fault that the voice promises more than the man can deliver.


Strongly disagree with the comment about Bert being better than Sutton or Thom, and I'd drop Bert a couple more spots on the list. But I agree with the rest.

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 Post subject: Re: The Chase experience and attendance
 Post Posted: Thu Mar 17, 2016 9:09 am 
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Wow. Disagree with pretty much everything said in #10. Daron and Thom were way better than Steve with Daron being my fav. With that being said, they have Schulte at 11...I like him better than Steve.


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 Post subject: Re: The Chase experience and attendance
 Post Posted: Thu Mar 17, 2016 3:35 pm 
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DBACKSHEELSPANTHS wrote:
Wow. Disagree with pretty much everything said in #10. Daron and Thom were way better than Steve with Daron being my fav. With that being said, they have Schulte at 11...I like him better than Steve.



x2.

Remember when TB posted on the old board? It was just a goodbye post, but it was cool. 8-)

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 Post subject: Re: The Chase experience and attendance
 Post Posted: Thu Mar 17, 2016 6:16 pm 
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DBACKSHEELSPANTHS wrote:
Wow. Disagree with pretty much everything said in #10. Daron and Thom were way better than Steve with Daron being my fav. With that being said, they have Schulte at 11...I like him better than Steve.


The "overeager company guy" part was pretty accurate though!

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 Post subject: Re: The Chase experience and attendance
 Post Posted: Sat Apr 16, 2016 10:25 pm 
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Anyone know what night they are going to hang the Cactus League Championship banner?

I want to make sure I get tickets for that one! :twisted:


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 Post subject: Re: The Chase experience and attendance
 Post Posted: Sat Apr 16, 2016 11:22 pm 
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They should talk to the same guy that made the Indianapolis Colts' AFC Championship Participant banners.

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 Post subject: Re: The Chase experience and attendance
 Post Posted: Sun Apr 17, 2016 5:18 am 
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The Shadow wrote:
Anyone know what night they are going to hang the Cactus League Championship banner?

I want to make sure I get tickets for that one! :twisted:


:lol::lol:

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 Post subject: Re: The Chase experience and attendance
 Post Posted: Sun Apr 17, 2016 7:36 pm 
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The Shadow wrote:
Anyone know what night they are going to hang the Cactus League Championship banner?

I want to make sure I get tickets for that one! :twisted:


With the start to this season, I needed that laugh. :-)

Thanks Shadow!

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 Post subject: Re: The Chase experience and attendance
 Post Posted: Tue Apr 26, 2016 11:55 am 
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One thing I've been thinking about, and I'm sure it's been mentioned, but you look directly across the street from Chase, and its a wasteland everywhere except for that one empty apartment tower. Directly to the north is a blank wall and parking garage, the west side is basically an alley with restaurant dumpsters on one side and a parking garage on the other, and don't get started on to the south and east. If there is a valid reason to depart downtown, it's for a greater control of the areas surrounding the ballpark.

The Diamondbacks sure haven't helped themselves in regards to attendance, but neither have their neighbors.

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 Post subject: Re: The Chase experience and attendance
 Post Posted: Tue Apr 26, 2016 1:37 pm 
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it's been a few years since I kicked around down there, but doesn't the city/county own a lot of the land around the ballpark?

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 Post subject: Re: The Chase experience and attendance
 Post Posted: Tue Apr 26, 2016 1:49 pm 
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dirtygary wrote:
One thing I've been thinking about, and I'm sure it's been mentioned, but you look directly across the street from Chase, and its a wasteland everywhere except for that one empty apartment tower. Directly to the north is a blank wall and parking garage, the west side is basically an alley with restaurant dumpsters on one side and a parking garage on the other, and don't get started on to the south and east. If there is a valid reason to depart downtown, it's for a greater control of the areas surrounding the ballpark.

The Diamondbacks sure haven't helped themselves in regards to attendance, but neither have their neighbors.


this point was addressed in This Article by Soco at Azsnakepit

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 Post subject: Re: The Chase experience and attendance
 Post Posted: Tue Apr 26, 2016 5:26 pm 
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The Dbacks have also had working arrangements with Gila River Indian Community. Why wouldn't the south west corner of the intersections of I-10, 202 San Tan, and 202 South Mountain be viable? Perhaps more viable, because it's not in the flight path to Sky Harbor. The 202 San Tan should be completed by 2020, well before the Dbacks would move. Wouldn't be surprised if the GRIC has plans for major development of that area west of I-10, South of South Mountain Fwy, East of 40th St., and north of Wild Horse Pass Hotel and Casino and the golf course.


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 Post subject: Re: The Chase experience and attendance
 Post Posted: Tue Apr 26, 2016 11:21 pm 
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dirtygary wrote:
One thing I've been thinking about, and I'm sure it's been mentioned, but you look directly across the street from Chase, and its a wasteland everywhere except for that one empty apartment tower. Directly to the north is a blank wall and parking garage, the west side is basically an alley with restaurant dumpsters on one side and a parking garage on the other, and don't get started on to the south and east. If there is a valid reason to depart downtown, it's for a greater control of the areas surrounding the ballpark.

The Diamondbacks sure haven't helped themselves in regards to attendance, but neither have their neighbors.

This cuts both ways. There's not a lot of incentive for businesses dependent on foot traffic to open in the immediate vicinity of the ballpark because it's completely worthless for helping to draw customers 281 days of the year. If entrepreneurs felt like it was a smart risk to hitch their fortunes to the D-backs, they would do so. Instead, new small businesses are opening basically everywhere else downtown.


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 Post subject: Re: The Chase experience and attendance
 Post Posted: Wed Apr 27, 2016 2:33 pm 
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Strebor wrote:
dirtygary wrote:
One thing I've been thinking about, and I'm sure it's been mentioned, but you look directly across the street from Chase, and its a wasteland everywhere except for that one empty apartment tower. Directly to the north is a blank wall and parking garage, the west side is basically an alley with restaurant dumpsters on one side and a parking garage on the other, and don't get started on to the south and east. If there is a valid reason to depart downtown, it's for a greater control of the areas surrounding the ballpark.

The Diamondbacks sure haven't helped themselves in regards to attendance, but neither have their neighbors.

This cuts both ways. There's not a lot of incentive for businesses dependent on foot traffic to open in the immediate vicinity of the ballpark because it's completely worthless for helping to draw customers 281 days of the year. If entrepreneurs felt like it was a smart risk to hitch their fortunes to the D-backs, they would do so. Instead, new small businesses are opening basically everywhere else downtown.

Those small businesses are opening everywhere else for a reason - they have to. I don't see them setting up shop in the garage to the north. There just aren't any options next to the ballpark. However, there are numerous examples of food/drink clusters directly next to other ballparks that are in far less-convenient locations than Chase Field's downtown site, yet still remain viable because of the foot traffic from those 2-3 million people during those 81 days.

All that aside, the only chance to keep the team downtown is to transfer ownership of Chase Field to the Club at the end of the lease. I'm fairly certain the economic impact from 25 years of the crowds downtown has exceeded the money invested in the stadium. If the public is "whole", just give them the stadium and let them do whatever they want with the facility. As much as I was initially opposed to any restructuring of the terms on principle, the reality is that a transfer of facility ownership is the only way to keep them from relocating. I'm fine with allowing the Diamondbacks to fund their own renovation and remain in that facility as long as possible, and if/when they vacate, control of the site returns to the City/County for redevelopment.


Bickley ripping on the local fans… Same stuff we've been saying for years.

http://www.azcentral.com/story/sports/m ... /83568698/

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 Post subject: Re: The Chase experience and attendance
 Post Posted: Wed Apr 27, 2016 3:26 pm 
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dirtygary wrote:
Those small businesses are opening everywhere else for a reason - they have to. I don't see them setting up shop in the garage to the north. There just aren't any options next to the ballpark. However, there are numerous examples of food/drink clusters directly next to other ballparks that are in far less-convenient locations than Chase Field's downtown site, yet still remain viable because of the foot traffic from those 2-3 million people during those 81 days.

All that aside, the only chance to keep the team downtown is to transfer ownership of Chase Field to the Club at the end of the lease. I'm fairly certain the economic impact from 25 years of the crowds downtown has exceeded the money invested in the stadium. If the public is "whole", just give them the stadium and let them do whatever they want with the facility. As much as I was initially opposed to any restructuring of the terms on principle, the reality is that a transfer of facility ownership is the only way to keep them from relocating. I'm fine with allowing the Diamondbacks to fund their own renovation and remain in that facility as long as possible, and if/when they vacate, control of the site returns to the City/County for redevelopment.

There used to be available real estate west and southwest of the ballpark and people did try. Remember Jackson's on 3rd? They weren't the only ones. As I recall, the original idea was that the Warehouse District would turn into an entertainment district. It just didn't happen. Lots of businesses have bought buildings or opened their office in the Warehouse District in the last few years, but they aren't food/drink vendors. Entrepreneurs simply haven't believed in tying their fortunes to the D-backs for a long time now.

The issue isn't just whether the initial investment has been recouped, it's also a matter of opportunity cost. Could that land and the public funds have generated greater economic impact if they were utilized for other purposes? I think the evidence is pretty clear that the D-backs are not an engine of growth for downtown, particularly in comparison to the alternatives.

A new ballpark isn't going to move the needle enough to compete with the Dodgers or Giants and the redevelopment of downtown is happening in spite of the team's failure to draw more fans than they were a decade ago. I'm staunchly opposed to any further handouts to Kendrick and company. They've proven they aren't serious about winning, so this is down to just being a fiscal matter. I bet the land occupied by the D-backs could be far more productive for Phoenix if it was redeveloped.

If one of the tribes wants to subsidize the next expansion of Kendrick's baseball card collection, more power to 'em.


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 Post subject: Re: The Chase experience and attendance
 Post Posted: Wed Apr 27, 2016 3:39 pm 
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dirtygary wrote:
Bickley ripping on the local fans… Same stuff we've been saying for years.

http://www.azcentral.com/story/sports/m ... /83568698/

I used to have that position, then at some point I changed my mind: The D-backs need to give people a reason to be excited. They aren't entitled to an active and engaged fanbase.

The fact is they've trotted out a mediocre to godawful team for the last four years and in all but two of the last 13. Fans should be indifferent to the .500 team that's on the field right now. That's all they've earned.

If 11 out of 13 gallons of milk I bought at the store were spoiled, I'd have pretty low expectations for the 14th.


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 Post subject: Re: The Chase experience and attendance
 Post Posted: Wed Apr 27, 2016 5:42 pm 
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I think that you can say Bickley is right while also saying that the team on the field needs to be better to generate that excitement too.

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 Post subject: Re: The Chase experience and attendance
 Post Posted: Wed Apr 27, 2016 5:47 pm 
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JoeCB91 wrote:
I think that you can say Bickley is right while also saying that the team on the field needs to be better to generate that excitement too.



I agree to this. And, in my experience, anytime you try to start a chant or get "overly excited" you are hushed by the 90 year old ushers.

Before anyone jumps down my throat, I have been to 3 Dbacks games the last 4 years. Maybe it is different now, but I am going by when I regularly went to games (when I still lived with my parents basically :lol: ).

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 Post subject: Re: The Chase experience and attendance
 Post Posted: Thu Apr 28, 2016 8:48 am 
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Strebor wrote:
I used to have that position, then at some point I changed my mind: The D-backs need to give people a reason to be excited. They aren't entitled to an active and engaged fanbase.

This. This. This.

And what the hell do the dbax expect from the fanbase they've attempted to capture? Do they expect the parents with their two small children to get crazy at the stadium? Did they expect all the seniors they attract to get crazy at the stadium? Do they expect the fans in the bleachers with ushers hovering everywhere to get crazy at the stadium?

You know who gets rambunctious at the stadium? Younger people without kids. They're the ones that still have a beer and a dog at the yard and heckle/cheer. It sure as hell ain't the ones with the concern of their kids watching daddy's behavior.

The Diamondbacks are so concerned with contriving "energy" and "excitement", but every action they've taken has managed to achieve the exact opposite - they prevent the organic development of a stadium culture and fandom. Every single time a cheer/chant gets started, like out in the bleachers or in the upper deck, it's drowned out by a stadium prompt blasting on the PA. How the hell is the crowd supposed to develop a culture when the team shoots em down every time???

Obviously the stadium prompts aren't exclusive to Chase, they're certainly at other ballparks, too. But the difference is those fanbases had an opportunity to create their stadium culture over the course of generations before the stadium prompts began, so it wasn't the impediment it was in PHX as this club was trying to create a culture.

At the end of the day, the Diamondbacks can complain all they want. But they have exactly the type of crowd they have actively and consistently sought out from the very beginning.

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 Post subject: Re: The Chase experience and attendance
 Post Posted: Thu Apr 28, 2016 9:38 am 
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Not only do they nurture that crowd at the ballpark, but even on the tv broadcasts. We've got to be entertained while we watch a game on tv. Berthiaume and Brenly are like a Vegas lounge act during a game. DH is more like PT Barnum than a MLB exec. He just doesn't get it. Baseball has survived and thrived for decades because of the GAME, not the side shows at the ballpark or on television broadcasts. I got my son to love the game and he his son, not because of all the antics guys like DH can think of, but rather pure and simple THE GAME.

And now to piss everybody off. Baseball is not and should not be a math class or a statistics class. KISS, sit back, relax, and enjoy THE GAME with all it's idiosyncrasies, quirks, and frustrations. Go to a T-ball game (go to a lot of them) and watch the game in it's simplest form to learn to enjoy baseball again. Those kids could care less about WAR, Rtot, etc., nor do most of their parents. "This... is a simple game. You throw the ball. You hit the ball. You catch the ball." All you needed to know about a player was on the back of his baseball card.


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